CDavis7M wrote: ↑Fri Sep 20, 2019 2:15 pm
Brandobras, instead of picking and choosing two line out of context, go back and read "Events" (MELE p. 40, 41) "Actions and Card Play" (MELE p. 50), "Timing Rules" (MELE, p. 69), and the Glossary on Action, Declaring an Action, Resolving an Action, Chain of Effects, Targeting, Active Condition, and Passive Condition (MELE 87-91). It's only a few pages but it is dense.
By your statement -- an active condition of discarding a card does not target the discarded card
Exactly.
Discarding Card_B is a typical active condition for some other Action_A of Card_A. If you can't choose Card_B for the discarding action to be played out through (i.e., target Card_B), how would Card_B ever be discarded?
Discarding is not an action. It is an active condition. You choose the card to be discarded by the active condition by . . . choosing the card. It is not a target.
It's clear that active conditions can have targets. Tapping a card, discarding a card, targeting a card -- these Active Condition activities are all actions. ALL active conditions either HAVE targets or ARE targets.
No.
Targeting: Choosing a specific entity through which a card or effect will be played out. An entity chosen as such is the "target" of the action.
I'll even go further:
Cards which affect an entire class of other cards do not target (e.g., Wake of War).
Spell. Wizard only. All Nazgul events are discarded
Wizard's River Horses, explicitly, by rule, discards events without targeting them.
Targeting is not required to affect any entity in the game. An
action which affects an in-game entity likely targets it, according to the restrictions on targeting. But active conditions are explicitly not actions.
Also, Active conditions ARE actions except they are defined to not be actions for the purpose of declaring and resolving actions in a chain of effects.
No. They are prerequisites for actions. The definition for actions explicitly says they are not actions by noting the key difference.
Merely requiring presence of some card "in play" without targeting the card can be a condition, but it is not an active condition.
CRF, Active Conditions wrote:An active condition must be in play or established when the action requiring it is declared.
The requirement that a card be in play most assuredly is an active condition. Or we can just go to the definition of a Condition, Active:
A prerequisite for an action actively made by a player. Typically this involves tapping a character, discarding an item, or having a character of a particular skill in play.
Please stop making up rules. Active conditions are specifically stated not to be actions in the definition of Action. Having a particular card in play is listed as an example of an active condition. Cards can be affected without being targeted.
The game is flawed, but this does not mean it cannot be loved.