On-guard

The place to ask and debate all rules issues related to MECCG.
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Gaereth Barethson
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Easy one I guess, but can on-guard cards can be played on non-moving companies?
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Theo
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On-guard can be playced on non-moving companies' sites.
Last edited by Theo on Sun Feb 09, 2020 6:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Konrad Klar
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On-guard cards may not be played. They may be placed.
We will not speak of such things even in the morning of the Shire.
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CDavis7M
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Don't just take their word for it.
METW p. 61 / MELE p. 67 wrote:PLACING A CARD ON-GUARD
During the movement/hazard phase of your opponent's turn, you may place one card on.guard for each of your opponent's companies. This card is played face down next to the company's new site or next to its current site if it did not move.
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Gaereth Barethson
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Thanks guys!

Do players often place "dead" card on-guard on site during movement/hazard phase, resolve hand size and than discard that on-guard card at he end of turn when it returns to hand? Feels like cheating a bit...
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Vastor Peredhil
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Yes, is a main Feature during tournament play
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i gwanunig
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Gaereth Barethson wrote: ↑Sun Feb 09, 2020 2:09 pm Thanks guys!

Do players often place "dead" card on-guard on site during movement/hazard phase, resolve hand size and than discard that on-guard card at he end of turn when it returns to hand? Feels like cheating a bit...
If you first return it to hand , and then resolve your hand size its ok. What is not ok is when you discard a card at the end-of-turn-phase, draw to 8 and then remove the on-guard card.
What business does an Elf, a Man and a Dwarf have in the Steiermark? Speak quickly!
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Konrad Klar
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I was under impression that an unrevealed on-guard card is returned to hand at the end of (company's) site phase.
We will not speak of such things even in the morning of the Shire.
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i gwanunig
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The on-guard card stays in place until the end-of-turn phase, and returns to your hand at the beginning of it. Unfortunately I cannot find the official ruling.
What business does an Elf, a Man and a Dwarf have in the Steiermark? Speak quickly!
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CDavis7M
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i gwanunig wrote: ↑Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:56 am The on-guard card stays in place until the end-of-turn phase, and returns to your hand at the beginning of it. Unfortunately I cannot find the official ruling.
Hm... I can only find:
METW 61 wrote:10 PLAYING A DRAWING CARDS
PLACING A CARD ON-GUARD
...
The card will remain on that site until one of the following occurs:
  • The company decides to face teh site's automatic attack...
  • The company plays a card keyed to the site...
  • Otherwise, return the card to your hand at the end of the site phase.
MELE 67 wrote:10 PLAYING A DRAWING CARDS
PLACING A CARD ON-GUARD
...
The card will remain on that site until one of the following occurs:
  • The company decides to face the site's automatic attack...
  • The company plays a card that potentially taps the site...
  • Otherwise, return the card to your hand at the end of the site phase.
Challenge Deck Rules Summary p. 13 and 14 wrote:4 MOVEMENT/HAZARD PHASE
PLACING A CARD ON-GUARD
...
The card will remain on the site until either:
  • The company decides to face the site's automatic attack...
  • The company plays a card that potentially would tap an untapped site...
  • The site phase ends. Return the card to your hand

Thinking about it more, this smells like a CoE rulings... Sure enough:
CoE Digest 26 wrote:From: Chad Martin <chad@t...>
Date: Mon Apr 22, 2002 4:55 am
Subject: [NetRep] Rulings Digest #26

2) Hand limit:
Question: if at the end of the turn you have, say, ten cards in your hand, You must discard down to eight (8), right?

*** At the beginning of your end of turn phase:
1. Return any on-guard cards that are in play back to your hand.
2. If you had no on-guard cards in play, you may discard one card from your hand.
3. Draw up or discard down to your hand size, usually 8.
As is typical, the Netrep doesn't cite the rules.

And then the CoE Netrep was given a second opportunity to read the rules:
CoE Digest 27a wrote:From: Chad Martin <chad@t...>
Date: Mon Apr 29, 2002 3:34 am
Subject: [NetRep] Rulings Digest #27
[Editors note: accidentally two digests were published as #27. This is the first, now labeled #27a]

>*** At the beginning of your end of turn phase:
>1. Return any on-guard cards that are in play back to your hand.
>2. If you had no on-guard cards in play, you may discard one card
>from your hand.
>3. Draw up or discard down to your hand size, usually 8.

Can't seem to find your step #2 in the rules or the CRF.
Are you sure about this Chad?

*** No. Here's the proper sequence to follow:
1. Return any on-guard cards that are in play back to your hand.
2. Discard one card from your hand, if you wish.
3. Draw up or discard down to your hand size, usually 8.
Sometimes rulings are based on how people casually play the game instead of how the rules are written. Here with on-guard cards, it probably makes no difference. Other time it does make a difference.
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