But Bandobras, this would force you to go to the minion site versions. Is this what you want?"Playable if you have Bad Company in play and at least three orcs or trolls, one of whom is a leader."
Frodo
This means that a player could still play his Rick/Smoke on a hero site as before, but if Plotting Ruin is already in play, the opponent is now alerted to his evil nature, and sees him as overt. The careful FW player could also burn down sites and not play Plotting Ruin until the last turn or so, which would mean he could potentially keep burning sites all game while keeping his overt status (just like the original PRuin (V), but at the cost of hand cramp and not developing any needed stage points. To the hero opponent, this would then represent such nefarious activities happening "covertly", without the opponent recognizing that he is overtly evil.Playable if you have at least 7 SP. Your Burning Rick Cot and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth full points. If you have at least one Burning Rick Cot and Tree or Smoke on the Wind in play, all of your companies are considered overt.
Why? If you have bad company and three orcs/trolls, none of them has to come with your FW and a few followers. It just makes it more likely that you'll be visiting minion sites.Frodo wrote:But Bandobras, this would force you to go to the minion site versions. Is this what you want?"Playable if you have Bad Company in play and at least three orcs or trolls, one of whom is a leader."
Frodo
sounds nice, but again, then you need to use minion sites wich are too though for the limited characters that FWs haves... I think that the way to go is to make this card a bit more hard to be played... Any way that makes a character use minion sites leads to a situation in wich playing minion to burn sites is far more better. I think we want here to create new game styles, not duplicate an already created (minion) strategy in a FW deck...Frodo wrote:That's not a bad idea, Jambo.
It still seems slightly strange to me that you can remain covert as an FW and burn down hero sites. I know that minions can remain covert by doing so, but the difference is still large--you can CVCC minions regardless of covert/overt status, for one thing.
I have one last suggestion which is kind of neat from a story perspective:
Plotting Ruin
This means that a player could still play his Rick/Smoke on a hero site as before, but if Plotting Ruin is already in play, the opponent is now alerted to his evil nature, and sees him as overt. The careful FW player could also burn down sites and not play Plotting Ruin until the last turn or so, which would mean he could potentially keep burning sites all game while keeping his overt status (just like the original PRuin (V), but at the cost of hand cramp and not developing any needed stage points. To the hero opponent, this would then represent such nefarious activities happening "covertly", without the opponent recognizing that he is overtly evil.Playable if you have at least 7 SP. Your Burning Rick Cot and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth full points. If you have at least one Burning Rick Cot and Tree or Smoke on the Wind in play, all of your companies are considered overt.
Thoughts? This version at least seems a lot less weird to me, themewise--the FW player who wants points for his activities must reveal himself at some point--but does not take away from an existing deck types.
--Frodo
Plotting Ruin wrote:Playable if you have at least 7 stage points. Your Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth full marshalling points. If you have at least one Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree in play, your companies must use minion sites for Border-holds and Free-holds. If you have at least one Smoke on the Wind in play, your companies are considered overt. Place any subsequent Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind with this card. If there are no cards placed with this card, this card gives -3 marshalling points.
Plotting Ruin wrote:Playable if you have at least 7 stage points. Your Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth +1 marshalling point. If you have at least one Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree in play, your companies must use minion sites for Border-holds and Free-holds. If you have at least one Smoke on the Wind in play, your companies are considered overt. Place any subsequent Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind with this card: Smoke on the Wind is worth +1 marshalling point. If there are no cards placed with this card, this card gives -2 marshalling points.
i don't think that is a bummer, imo, that is the twisted part of the card...Thorsten the Traveller wrote:on the restriction side, we can also lure people into using minion sites by saying: return any ally in company playable at the site to your hand, it may not be played at site by you. In analogy with the faction idea, I suppose hero allies wouldn't like you burning their home either. Since most resources that tap hero free/borders will be allies, that is a bummer, so you are lured into playing items, thus using minion sites.
JAMBO VERSION 2Playable if you have at least 7 SP. Your Burning Rick Cot and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth full points. If you have at least one Burning Rick Cot and Tree or Smoke on the Wind in play, all of your companies are considered overt.
JAMBO VERSION 3Plotting Ruin wrote:
Playable if you have at least 7 stage points. Your Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth full marshalling points. If you have at least one Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree in play, your companies must use minion sites for Border-holds and Free-holds. If you have at least one Smoke on the Wind in play, your companies are considered overt. Place any subsequent Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind with this card. If there are no cards placed with this card, this card gives -3 marshalling points.
THORSTEN VERSION 4Plotting Ruin wrote:
Playable if you have at least 7 stage points. Your Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind are worth +1 marshalling point. If you have at least one Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree in play, your companies must use minion sites for Border-holds and Free-holds. If you have at least one Smoke on the Wind in play, your companies are considered overt. Place any subsequent Burning Rick, Cot, and Tree and Smoke on the Wind with this card: Smoke on the Wind is worth +1 marshalling point. If there are no cards placed with this card, this card gives -2 marshalling points.
THORSTEN VERSION 52 MP. Payable (even during site phase) if you have 4 SP or more and a Smoke or Burning in play. Place any Smoke or Burning you play hereafter with this card, it is worth full MP's. All your companies are considered overt companies. Cannot be duplicated.
Plotting Ruin, 1 sp. (1mp+)
If you have a Burning Rick, Cot and Tree or Smoke on the Wind in play, your companies must use minion sites for border-holds, free-holds and hero-havens. Place any subsequent Burning Rick, Cot and Tree and Smoke on the Wind with this card in stead of in your marshalling point pile. Place any site you entered by tapping a character with that site as home site with this card in stead of discarding it. If you have a burning Rick Cot and Tree or Smoke on the Wind in play, this card is worth 1 mp plus 1 mp for each card under it. Cannot be duplicated by a given player.