Morannon

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

How does this fizzling work here? If I play Snowstorm, or Chance of Being Lost, and company does not arrive at Barad-dur, then Morannon is fizzled because site phase conditions are not met? bit strange, and a pitty, now you need 3x Morannon V :cry:

Why did you not take the road that you play this card on company at MT (with the ring), and they may move from MT whenever they want to Barad-dur using this card's special movement? It will normally amount to the same thing, you don't want to linger anyway, but if you get sent back, at least you don't need another card to try again.

what if your ringbearer is taken prisoner at Barad-dur with Troll purse, can you still make the roll? :lol:
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Post by Frodo »

How does this fizzling work here? If I play Snowstorm, or Chance of Being Lost, and company does not arrive at Barad-dur, then Morannon is fizzled because site phase conditions are not met?
"Fizzling" is a term normally reserved for when a card loses its target. In the case you are quoting, Morannon gets discarded not because it fizzles but because the card says right on it that if the company does not get to Barad-dur, the card is discarded.

I think it would be quite difficult to word that the card stays on table until you use it without adding even a single word. If one is afraid of Snowstorm, they better have a Smoke Rings in hand (or in playdeck/sb) so they can smoke the Morannon back in.

Btw, "alone" is only for the attack, so you can Friend or Three the CC.

Very funny about Troll-Purse... yes, Sauron walks right up to the Ringbearer and challenges him/her to a duel, even if captured!

Frodo

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

Shouldn't be too difficult though:
Playable on a company at Minas Tirith. The company may move from Minas Tirith to Barad-dur using site path...If moving thus, the following applies:

This is indeed 3 words longer. Only issue is whether 'the following' would refer to everything following, or just until end of phrase. I would say everything following, but maybe some of the Nitpick Inc would disagree.

This would offer the advantage to be able to try several times if you are sent back/other way, or to play it at site phase, or to stay a turn in Minas Tirith for more preparations, whatever. If fact, you could have some guy staying at Minas Tirith to play this card while you gather rings. Bottom line: you think that's a problem?
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Post by Frodo »

I see two options: 1) reword it so you can play it on Minas Tirith and not move yet and have the card remain, and 2) reword it so you can move but if you get sent back in some way you can try again.

Regarding both of them, I'm not sure if the clause Thorsten suggested would be enough. Even so, we would *also* need to add the "cannot be duplicated" clause. I know it seems strange but this card is absolutely at the maximum word count and I have no idea how we can put this extra info in.

Regarding Number 1, is there really a large strategic advantage to this, other than the small one of getting one card out of your hand?

Regarding Number 2, wouldn't this also be tricky to word? We'd have to say it can stay on table if the RINGBEARER gets returned to his site. The reason we didn't want the card to continue to be playable *after* you reach the site (such as removing "discard this card" for "return this card to your hand", or just leaving it on table) is because it makes it too confusing to figure out what happens if you are no longer at Minas Tirith, and also a bit weaker on the hazard end of the card, too. Finally, if the Ringbearer gets returned, there's no reason why the rest of the company should be allowed to enter Barad-dur so easily... I think.

I'm open to wording suggestions but I'm not sure if it's worth wraggling over. Is it because we don't like the cheese factor of the ringbearer getting seized by terror?

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

why need can't be duplicated clause? You're afraid people might use it only to get to Barad-dur? If you enter the place and have the ring, you either win or loose, so you can duplicate all you like that won't matter. If you enter without the ring, the card offers no benefit at all.

Ringbearer being sent back by Terror is bit strange indeed.

I think you might skip the 'otherwise discard this card,' to save room. You think it's a problem if people stay at Barad-dur some turns to test the ring or whatever? It's not a requirement to have the ring when you move, likewise you made it 'at end of site phase' so you can still play Scroll there I guess, so it shouldn't be weird if you stay at Barad-dur without the One.
I think each turn you stay at Barad-dur is not only a turn wasted, but a very dangerous turn, so I don't agree it makes it weaker on the hazard end, you still have moved there via the ugly way. Only problem I see, is with people joining the company after this. You could have Galadriel with Nenya move there by herself, being virtually indestructable. And then you can have the wiz. with ringbearers move in via Nurn. Mind you, this is also possible now, but it would need to happen in the same turn.

I just think that if you must play and resolve this card the turn you want to move to Barad-dur, then it's a definite sideboard. If it's a definite siteboard, you'll get it in just before end of cycle. If it's end of cycle, you're not likely to get it back in hand quickly should it get discarded. So a single Chance of Being Lost could ruin it all. (this could be solved by making it 'not considered region movement', but that's even extra space).

Maybe the take to hand option is best then. You'd have to get back to Minas Tirith anyway if you are lead astray. It's the easiest solution, in stead of 'otherwise discard this card' just make it 'otherwise take this card back to hand.' I do think being able to play it some turn earlier and get it out of hand is a good tactical advantage, but that's just a concession then.
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Post by Frodo »

Hmm… those are good arguments, Thorsten!

Have you made the deck, or watched it at all? I’m wondering what others think. Specifically, has anyone ever WON with the card?

Maybe Thorsten’s right: we DON’T need a “otherwise, discard this card” clause, and we don’t need a “cannot be duplicated clause,” either, except maybe for theme because it’s a little weird to have all the attacks coming at you twice. There is one thing that’s being left out however.

>If you enter without the ring, the card offers no benefit at all.

That’s not completely true. It enables you to enter B-dur no matter what; regardless of Rivers, Lost in Free Domains, etc. Still, you have probably earned that benefit.

I may have forgotten about the fact that the Ringbearer can be in another company, but that seems okay.

>>I think each turn you stay at Barad-dur is not only a turn wasted, but a very dangerous turn… Only problem I see, is with people joining the company after this. You could have Galadriel with Nenya move there by herself, being virtually indestructable. And then you can have the wiz. with ringbearers move in via Nurn. Mind you, this is also possible now, but it would need to happen in the same turn.

Agreed that it remains dangerous, and perhaps it WOULD still be dangerous for Galadriel, IF we keep it so that everything on the card starting with “At the beginning of the mh, company faces 3 attacks…” keeps applying itself every turn this card is on the table, no matter where you are. This would mean that Galadriel, at least, is in trouble since she can’t Nenya at Barad-dur.

This is little weird thematically as well, though. Technically, you could move to Barad-dur, then move away somewhere (like Lorien), and squat elsewhere for another few turns and Sauron is still chasing you with all his goons. It seems more epic that he card can only be initiated once at Minas Tirith, and then potentially restarted there, but perhaps this isn’t how it comes across to everyone nor is that important.

Oops, just thought of more problems. Galadriel could actually just LEAVE Barad-dur, then another company with the ringbearer could sneak in there and still utilize Morannon. Maybe that’s not a negative at all though; Galadriel is the bluff. The only nice limitation is that the “company” must have at least one character survive so that the card remains.

Chance of Being Lost won’t work, because it IS special movement being used, not region movement. But I see your point.

It all comes down to whether or not people like the idea that you can stop this deck in one turn and shut it down completely (as compensation for the lack of rivers, etc. that can work), or if they see repeated tries as being fair.

If we let the card stay on table and you DON’T have to move yet, more tricky wording comes into play. We’d have to say something like “Playable during the organization phase on a company at Minas Tirith. The company may move to Barad-dûr (site path ). Whenever the company is moving to, or at, Barad-dur, at the beginning of the movement/ hazard phase, the company faces 3 attacks…”

Maybe that’s not too bad. Or is it?

Frodo

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Post by Vastor Peredhil »

Well,

in a game with beornd where he was going for Morannon,

one ren on the table was enought to stop him cold, as he had to face him as a creature and afterwards I could tap ren for CCs, also the cards you need in hand are many...
to have either some people untapped to help with corruption or face the strikes so that the ringbearer can stay untapped depending on what your hand has in stall.

he had the ring in play on ARagorn so he needed 2 x roll of 8

mfg Nicolai

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

Well my gccg inaptitude has prevented me from playing a game with Morannon V so far, but I have made attempt at a deck yes, thinking maybe to try it at Worlds, so I won't give it all away, but suffice to say that it's hard, and using Galadriel as decoy was one of my options, sneeking the other ones in around the back. :wink: That way you can leave the nazguls on the table yourself and Ren/Khamul doesn't trouble you.
This also scores you bigtime in coolness points of course!
As Vastor says, Ren is not so nice. Then again, there are many things not so nice. It's hard but it should be doable, however how you'll manage on Denethor I don't know, haha. And I'm also known to fail many rolls on the One...

Call me strange Frodo, but I always thought that Morannon represented just what it refers to: passing into Mordor by way of the Morannon, and specifically Aragorn standing in front of the gates challenging Sauron. Sauron already thinks Gorn has the ring in Minas Tirith, hence the preemptive strike there. Of course he would give chase eventually if Gorn decided to hike back to Lorien, but that's not the point of the card. I'd say, the attacks on the card just mention the opposition at the Black Gate. Therefore, each time you try to get to Barad-dur but fail, you have to pass through the gate again, defying the opposition there. Yet, as we know, the ringbearer did not pass that way, and so I think it's okay that this card doesn't require to be played on the ringbearer.

Since I do agree it's stupid you pass through the gate and then twiddle your thumbs at Barad-dur for some turns, I proposed to bring back the card to hand should you not get there, or should you 'get there' without the One (representing you didn't get there).
In other words, I think the one turn requirement is fine, but not the discard effect. You then go back to Minas Tirith to try again. You can leave by other ways than by Morannon, so I wouldn't leave the card on table just for the attacks.
Remains to be seen whether it should be playable on a comp. at MT whether they move or not, I would prefer that, but I agree with you that it is cumbersome to rephrase it in such fashion and it might take too many words, I'll have a look how it works out in sum.

minor stuff:
Agreed on the river advantage, but also agreed on the earned factor :wink:
Galadriel can play Nenya anywhere she likes, only the cc bonus doesn't apply at B-dur.
So the fact that the sitepaht is mentioned makes it special movement, you don't need to mention it's special movement?
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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

Okay, how about this for Morannon?

Morannon V: permanent event
Playable on a company at Minas Tirith. The company may opt to move to Barad-dur using special movement (site path ) and all of the following applies. At the beginning of the movement/hazard phase, the company faces these attacks: Orcs 5@10, Trolls 3@12, Men 1@13, and attacks from each Nazgul permanent-event in play. During the site phase at Barad-dur, Aragorn II, Boromir II, Denethor II, Faramir, Galadriel or Saruman bearing the One Ring must face an attack alone: Maia 1@24 (otherwise take this card to hand). Ignore any effects preventing the company to do nothing. If the attack is defeated, bearer faces a corruption check: if check is succesful, you win the game. Otherwise, you lose.
it's about the same lenght as the version 0.9
I saw no reason to specify when (at the end) during site phase the attack must be faced. If you want to play Scroll first or do other stuff, then fine, it's your choice. If you don't, then just procede immediately. The auto-attack is always the first thing in site phase, you can't do anything before that, so no risk of doing this before the auto. And it seems impossible to me people might do stuff after this card has resolved. But, it can easily be changed into end of site phase again.
And if you don't enter the site, you have to take this card to hand, so I see no reason to include 'must enter the site.' You're back at square one if you don't enter. To play this card just to avoid rivers/LiFD is pretty suicidal, more power to those people!

Typically enough, the ringbearer doesn't even have to be your character, it can be opponent's :-). Stupid thing is, if he doesn't make the rolls, you loose! Of course you deserve to loose if you're stupid enough to go to Barad-dur with Morannon V if opponent has the One there...that's why I didn't add 'your' to Aragorn etc. If you manage to win like this, you're the real king.
I put the names in alfabethical order, and corrected Boromir II
I corrected the number of attacks, since it's not specified, it could be up to 12.
I copied the interpunction of the last phrase stating the attack and cc, assuming it's absolutely clear like this that you do not just lose the game upon an unsuccesful cc, but also if you don't defeat the attack. In other words, it is waterproof that "Otherwise" refers to the whole sentence before, right?
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Post by Frodo »

Hello Thorsten,
>>I'd say, the attacks on the card just mention the opposition at the Black Gate. Therefore, each time you try to get to Barad-dur but fail, you have to pass through the gate again, defying the opposition there.
Sure, but if you are “at” Barad-dur, you can still be facing the Morannon attacks at the Black Gate. The company was just outside the castle of Barad-dur when the Mouth can strolling out to greet them, and all hell broke loose. Even the auto-attacks themselves are not attacks within the castle, but attempt to get inside the castle.
>Since I do agree it's stupid you pass through the gate and then twiddle your thumbs at Barad-dur for some turns, I proposed to bring back the card to hand should you not get there, or should you 'get there' without the One (representing you didn't get there).
Now that you got me thinking about the card, I’m wondering why the return to Minas Tirth is necessary. It seems really strange, narratively speaking (it’s not like you need to invoke Sauron’s wrath only by standing on the summit of Minas Tirith over and over… once should be enough… why would he leave you parked on his very doorstep?), and very weak from a game play point of view (waste another two turns?). Twiddling thumbs is only stupid if there are NO attacks. So I think Sauron’s onslaught should continue. This will be a nice surprise for the “surprise deck” that attempts to sneak the ringbearer around the corner to avoid the Morannon’s crazy attacks, then for whatever reasons decides he can’t enter the site (didn’t get the One, or auto-attacks tapped too many people)… now he has to deal with Sauron’s full strength because the Nine have finally flown back and “found” him!

We would have to write the card “During the site phase at Barad-dur, Aragorn II, Boromir II, Denethor II, Faramir, Galadriel or Saruman in this company…” in this case, so that it’s not possible for the trick-character (like Galadriel) to just split from the ringbearer’s squatting company and run off with Morranon on her.

I suppose I don’t mind the Minas Tirith company having the option to remain, depending on whether it’s wordable enough, this doesn’t give the deck too much power some how, yet it is actually useful in some way more than simply freeing up one card in your hand space, because that seems slight to me. Something like the following would now be necessary: “Playable on a company at Minas Tirith. The company may move to Barad-dur (site path ). If the company moves in this manner, or is at Barad-dur, they face the following attacks at the beginning of their m/h phase”.

Maybe that’s not so bad?

Other stuff: The “otherwise you lose” is supposed to refer to whether you fail the CC or the attack. My understanding is that “region movement” is using region card movement. Everything else is something else. You’re right, there’s no need to specify WHEN attack must be faced, or even to force people to enter the site. Good catches.

Your point about the opponent being able to use Morannon made me think of something crazy… wouldn’t it be cool if Morannon (V) could be used as an offensive card against traditional One Ring decks?? That is, if you stopped them for one turn at Mt. Doom. Thus, Morannon (V) would have a line like this: “During the site phase at Barad-dur, Aragorn II, Boromir II, Denethor II, Faramir, Galadriel or Saruman (or any opponent’s character at Mount Doom) bearing the One Ring must face an attack alone: Maia 1@24 (otherwise take this card to hand). Ignore any effects preventing the company to do nothing. If the attack is defeated, bearer faces a corruption check: if check is succesful, bearer’s player wins the game. Otherwise, he loses.”

Ha ha…

Maybe this isn’t such a dream idea, though. It could actually be a self-sideboarding hazard that is only playable if Morannon (V) is in play, which directly affects an opponent’s company at Mount Doom. Hmm, now I’m really getting some crazy ideas… how cool would it be if, rather than trying to STOP your opponent from winning, you are actually trying to HELP him to win?? Because this would be using Morannon at its most thematic: you are moving your company there to distract Sauron. Of course, YOU would steal the 7 TP prize and win the game rather than him. So the card would look something like this:
Sudden Call (V)
Permanent Event. Playable as resource or hazard if your Morannon (V) is in play with your company at Barad-dur, and opponent’s company with a character bearing the One Ring or Scroll of Isildur is at a site in Imlad Morgul, Gorgoroth, or Udun. Company is affected by Morannon (as if at Barad-dur), except that opponent’s Ringbearer may make the corruption check even if wounded by the Maia, and if that check is successful, you win the game instead. You may play resources that help the corruption check.
Ok, it’s a little awkward at the moment, but… WOW THIS IS SO COOL!!

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

yeah that would be really cool, to win by letting your opponent dunk! It would finally give Aragorn and company the credit they deserve for offering themselves up at the Gates...
But of course, the ringbearer had some part to play as well. Maybe make it a draw then? that's already a net gain/loss of 6 tp's more or less...

Your discard clause seemed to suggest that if you don't arrive at B-dur or without the ring, Sauron wouldn't exactly feel challenged and would not come out. It would be bussiness as usual, like if you go to B-dur now you only meet some wary Trolls. I don't feel you need to go back to Minas Tirith and repeat the challenge either.
We could move the attacks to beginning site phase at B-dur, I don't see what the difference is between facing the attacks after the hazards or before, it will usually only get harder. In fact, opponent has more time now to slab some more nazguls on the table.

How about making it about travelling to Cirith Gorgor, and there challenging Sauron? You would have two less HL and one less draw, but rest would be the same. The auto at Cirith Gorgor is actually worse than B-dur.

Morannon V: playable on comp. at Minas Tirith. A company at Cirith Gorgor may choose to tap this card (this card doesn't untap). If tapped, once during each site phase at a site in Udun/Gorgoroth the company faces the following attacks (-). . If tapped, you may replace site with Barad-dur. If this card is tapped and Aragorn etc. is at Barad-dur bearing The One Ring, at the end of site phase...

This is actually more or less like the original :wink: How and when you get from Minas Tirith to Cirith Gorgor doesn't matter, only that you get there. Also you can play Scroll at Cirith Gorgor and test there and then still move to B-dur for the challenge, so you can use the ring against the attacks without suffering possible ring-hazards. If you move to B-dur and don't score the ring, you still have to face the attacks each turn.

Also you can wait at Cirith Gorgor for the right moment. This is benificial for yourself if you want to sneak in via the back, or for a possible card and move against a ring-dunk at Mount Doom.

nb. Jambo perhaps you can move this part about Morannon to a Morannon V thread at this section? I suppose this isn't about playtesting anymore.
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Post by Frodo »

Wow... this card is starting to get really fascinating, now. I like your rather original suggestion of site-hopping. And a tie!!! What an ingenious idea, so thematic as well... but does it fit the criteria of game-balance? In other words, is it so incredibly difficult for Sudden Call (V) to be pulled off that the Aragorn player deserves to win completely? Probably not... I think that a tie is the right way to go. It's so interesting theme-wise that we should probably adjust the cards to fit this result, rather than the other way around.

Ah, it was the discard clause of Morannon that made you wonder about my intentions with Sauron. Understood.

The only difference between facing the attacks before or after is that if you face them before, it feels more like you are facing opposition on the way (during the journey). But perhaps that doesn't matter; book-wise, Sauron waited until they reached the end before launching his surprise. (Makes me wish we had room for haz player to launch a "surprise" from the discard pile.) Do you want to try rewording the card with your suggestions, Thorsten?

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Thorsten the Traveller
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Post by Thorsten the Traveller »

there's a few issues.
1 Do we feel it must be Aragorn etc. to challenge Sauron at the Gates? I suppose so. Original Morannon V is playable on any company, but if you want to have a draw via Sudden Call, I feel it must be at least one of the mentioned guys that is at Morannon, not some hobbit with a Mithril-coat! (would be enough to draw the Mouth out though :wink: ). This requirement can also be on Sudden Call of course, but then you cramp that card, so ideally it should be on Morannon.
2 Do we feel Aragorn etc. should be at Morannon or B-dur to challenge Sauron? theme-wise, if he'd be at B-dur he wouldn't be giving the ringbearer much of a chance. 3 Do we feel One Ring or Scroll should be present at Mount Doom for Sudden Call? Themewise yes, but both requirements will hamper the card seriously. The One isn't played until site phase, and Scroll is not always present. Therefore I'd say, just a gold-ring item must be present, representing the One. This btw. also means you can draw when opponent is playing Into Smoking Cone, but that will probably be to your disadvantage.
4 Do we feel Sudden Call may be brought into play from sideboard when we play Morannon V? is there space for it?
5 What can the dunk player do to defend against a draw? Kill the main guy? Is the requirement of having the specific character, Morannon, Sudden call and the One already enough warrent that this won't be played from sideboard as easy counter to dunk decks? If you play a committed Morannon, it'll be like a competition between the dunker and challenger, and whoever feels he's gonna loose, will play Sudden Call. That's fun, but also a pitty because how can you defend against that? At least a dunk player should also be able to play Sudden Call on the Morannon player, to make it fair!
6 Problem with this is, if Ringbearer loses the cc, then who loses? Both lose? That would be quite a concept, no TP's for any player!!!
7 For full surprise, should Morannon also be usable to dunk? If you do site-hopping, you can just as well hopp to Mount Doom. Added benefit, should you lose your guy on the way to do the challenge, you can still destroy the One. This means circumventing the special movement into Gorgoroth rule which was designed for dunking. Since you have to play this in Minas Tirith I suppose you lose a turn anyway, and you have to suffer the attacks, thus it is still not preferable to a normal dunk route, thus the spirit of that rule stays alive. On the other hand, this card doesn't have to be played on the ringbearer, so if you plan right you don't lose a turn. Of course, you can always move to B-dur, and next turn to Mount Doom anyway...
8 Maybe the whole Minas Tirith starting requirement isn't necessary, if the special movement in one turn is of the table. If one of the leaders arrives before the Gates, does it matter where he comes from? Galadriel and Saruman wouldn't come from there normally...


Morannon V:
Playable on a company at Minas Tirith. Company may move to Cirith Gorgor via Dagorlad. Tap this card when Aragorn II, Boromir II, Denethor II, Faramir, Galadriel or Saruman is in the company at Cirith Gorgor (ignore effects forcing company to do nothing). This card only untaps if company is not at a site in Udun or Gorgoroth. If tapped, each site phase company faces the following attacks: Orcs 5@10, Trolls 3@12, Men 1@13, and attacks from each nazgul permanent-event in play. Following these attacks, you may replace site with Barad-dur. If this card is tapped and one of aforementioned characters is at Barad-dur bearing The One Ring, at the end of site phase s/he faces an attack alone: maia 1@24. If attack is defeated, bearer makes a corruption check: if succesful, you win. Otherwise you lose.
Made it so one of the leaders has to be at the gates to tap this card. Otherwise the requirement has to be mentioned on Sudden Call. You can still sneak the ringbearer in via the back though.

Cracks of Doom V:
Playable on a company at Mount Doom. As resource playable if opponent has a tapped Morannon V in play. Also playable as a hazard at the beginning of the site phase, if you have a tapped Morannon V in play. Discard this card if company doesn't bear a gold-ring item, or if The One Ring is in play but not at Mount Doom. If not in play, the player of this card must replace a gold ring item in the company with The One Ring as if tested. The bearer of The One Ring makes a corruption check: if succesful, both players have a draw, otherwise, both players lose. Both players may play resources in support on corruption check.
A) I first had "The bearer of The One Ring faces an attack alone: maia 1@24 (cannot be cancelled). If bearer is still in active play following the attack...." but then thought that the whole idea was that the comp. at B-dur or Cirith Gorgor was distracting Sauron, so he would not attack at Mount Doom. Of course you can have Sauron attack opponent, but what would that matter, you both either win or lose if you play this card. I agree it feels a bit lame to just have the cc and be done with it, but that's what dunking actually means. We could introduce some Gollum attack of some kind of course...
B) made it playable at beginning of site phase as hazard, so that no testing is done yet. However, if you do arrive with The One, can you then play Cracks o Doom or Gollum's Fate in response? I suppose you can...
C) When would you play this card? Well, if your opponent has the Scroll and you feel you can't make the roll, or your wizard or main guy has died, so you feel at a disadvantage and you might fancy a draw, you can play this card, either as Morannon player or as dunk player. Or, as Morannon player, if opponent has The One in play, you can of course hope to kill or corrupt opponent, but maybe you feel playing it together you have more chances of actually scoring some TP's.
D) Only thing that bothers me, is that the dunk player has little defense to avoid this. He has The One, he's about to dunk and claim 7 TP's, and then the Morannon comp. says: hey we want part of the glory, we were here distracting The Eye. It's fair, and yet it's not. Of course if you see Morannon, you don't have to go to Mount Doom. And like I said, if you go with the One already tested, you may play your own Cracks in response to Cracks.

Also it would be fair if there were a mirrored option for the dunk player to invoke an attack by Sauron if the Morannon player has The One in play, prematurely so to speak, because that won't happen often, normally you score the One and then immediately challenge Sauron. This of course can easily be fixed to let the ringbearer face an attack by Sauron, whether at any site in Udun/Gorgoroth. If opponent fails, you should neither get points, because in effect you've helped cover the world in darkness. But if opponent becomes the new Ringlord, should you get equal points then? your mission at Mount Doom has failed after all? Unless you were the decoy and the Morannon comp. actually was out to become the new lord. Tolkien would shiver in his grave. :wink:

edit: added movement to Cirith Gorgor. If only ICE had made Cirith Gorgor in Dagorlad, would have been so much easier...
Last edited by Thorsten the Traveller on Wed May 07, 2008 10:31 am, edited 2 times in total.
Stone-age did not end because man ran out of rocks.

Vastor Peredhil
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Post by Vastor Peredhil »

:D
Me wants the mind enhancing drugs Eric uses at the moment :P

Great stuff Eric, you even answer your own questions great stuff

mfg Nicolai

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Nerdmeetsyou
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Post by Nerdmeetsyou »

I don't think we should interact Marronon with cracks of doom and dunking the ring in any way!!!
because this is already difficult enough without it!!!!

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